The Bible: A Homophobic Manual?

The Bible: A Homophobic Manual?

Ordinarily, I’m not one to either make a fuss over a view held or really question an opinion expressed. Views and opinions are a dime a dozen these days after all, however wrong they may be. What gets my dander up though is seeing folks, who ought to know better, trot out highly prejudiced views/opinions and try to pass such off as grounded facts, as has been the case of late on this forum.

Ere I be misconstrued, let me quickly state here that it’s always been my stand that all are within their right to hold whatever view, stand or opinion they would on whatever issue takes their fancy. What I take issue with is when such view, especially ill-grounded ones, are passed off as fact or the attempt made to so do.

I speak especially of the Kirk Franklin post of the other day, and the various reactions to it, particularly those of KD’s resident cynics and noisemakers club. I’d wondered what the man said that was wrong and non-factual, especially pertaining to the Bible not being the homophobic manual your average homophobe would have it. The rather interesting response I got from a certain member of what I’d termed The Noisemakers Club is what necessitates this piece.

Now, this bit is not me putting up a defense of certain provisions of the Bible; the Bible taken wholly can well defend itself, but certain views left unchallenged for long may presume to take on the toga of truth, especially for the ignorant, the naïve and the feeble-minded.

As some KDians would have us believe, the Bible is a homophobic manual based solely on the strength of Leviticus 18:22: Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind. It is abomination.

That’s one of the homophobe’s favorite verses, I may add, along with Leviticus 20:13: If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Quite terrible, I’ll say, that last one.

I did wonder though: are just those two verses – four, if we isolate Romans 1:26-27 from the 32 that make up that chapter (Paul ma no wan help matter here with him language), four or at most five out of over 32,000 – enough to tag the Bible a homophobe’s/hater’s manual? Really? That’s like 0.01% of the verses contained therein. Quite significant enough, to hear them tell.

In that vein, what then shall we say of the provisions of Leviticus 18:6-20, 20:10-12, 14, 17-21, Deuteronomy 22:22-25? (I’m sticking to just those two books; many more abound, both in the Old Testament and Paul’s epistles). Surely, based on the preponderance of “evidence”, it can be rightly argued that the Bible is rather a strongly heterophobic manual than a homophobic one. The Old Testament has 613 ordinances, of which only two are homophobic, while having 30 provisions or more against the heteros. So, heterophobic it surely must be.

Not that I believe any of that, anyway.

The Bible is not a homophobic manual or even a heterophobic one, I believe. Neither can it be likened to a volume of hate, as a resident fool so likes to assert. Among other things, it is a set of religious cum moral/behavioral guide. A compendium of spiritual principles for those so inclined and guide for moral and behavioral guide for others who would abide by it. The civil and criminal ordinances contained in its Old Testament was tailored for the protection, survival and progress the theocratic state that then was Israel and its people, according to what they knew then and the culture prevalent accordingly.

Said laws and ordinances were what Jesus Christ updated and condensed into the two golden rules that guide the life and conduct of his true followers since: The Love of God and The Love of fellow man.

Love – that is what the Bible is about.

Heck, it even has a book contained therein dedicated to teaching the timid on how to go about chyking their love interest. But that is by the way.

Love and the various ways it is shown, lived and expressed – that is what the Bible guides us to. To Mercy, Grace, Justice, Truth and Peace.

The hateful man, sorely lacking in knowledge, may try to twist certain parts of it to suit his purpose, but that does not and never will detract from its essence and mission.

It then becomes galling when I come across members of a community that prides itself on being enlightened, knowledgeable and informed, way above the rabble that is supposedly the other side of the argument, be brought to so low an estate as those they rail against, cherry-picking a part or two of a guidebook to cast it in bad light, same as the rabble would do to give us a bad name. All this just to win an argument that’ll never end.

How did we come to this sorry pass, I wonder?

It’s time to step back from all that noise, I propose, and do some form of reassessment of what we’re about. Are we engaged in the right arguments to start with? Are we even arguing with the right facts, the right points? Are we going about it all still clear-headed or have we been carried away by the heat of battle, slashing left and right, knowing neither friend nor foe?

For those who would denigrate the Bible, who think the path to victory in the fight for equality, lies only with the destruction of the Bible while having only a glancing knowledge of it, I would advise a change of mindset. Pick up a Bible today and read, even if as an academic exercise. Read every bit as part of a certain whole, situating them in their rightful contexts, not missing the forest for the trees. I’d like to know if you’ll be of the same mindset after you’ve done so. See if you really believe the Bible to be the go-to manual for those who would propagate hate as you assumed, or the guide for a worthwhile living it’s meant to be.

The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance. It is the illusion of knowledge. – Stephen Hawkings

Written by Tiercel de Claron

Previous Chizzie's Jukebox (Episode 5)
Next Michael Lucas Responds To Allegations Of Leaving “Urine, Semen And Fecal Matter” All Over Rented Apartment

About author

You might also like

Our Stories 6 Comments

You Are Doing Yourself

If people could read minds, what would be in the papers about you? Me, I’d have done whatever it’d take to disappear every time I think. You know why? Because

Our Stories 116 Comments

What The Married Gay Indian Had To Say About His Marriage And Sexuality

An unnamed 37-year-old Indian man writes speaks out in an essay titled “My Wife Is Friends With My Boyfriend: A Gay Man On His ‘Situation’”, and published by the Hindustan

Our Stories 57 Comments

THE IDEA ABOUT SUPPORT

I have thoroughly enjoyed Kito Diaries from the very day it popped into existence in the blogosphere. I bless the gods, whoever they are and where ever they are, for

106 Comments

  1. Masked Man
    November 25, 06:35 Reply

    ‘Resident Cynics’, ‘Noisemakers Club’, ‘Resident fool’.
    TDC, really? Such high handedness. I wonder the love you are preaching with the bible.
    Anyway, the bible isn’t my moral compass. So I don’t have to read it, or refer to it. I have a conscience that ticks just fine.

    • ken
      November 25, 06:42 Reply

      Abi o…so much insult this early morning!
      Pp you for help us delete all that before posting na

      Btw no matter how u argue it, the Bible makes no room for homosexuality. Infact, even masturbation is not allowed, let alone sleeping with a man. And guess what? The hateful homophobes only need one verse to unleash their ignorant wickedness and on gays

      The truth is you can be gay and still love and worship “God”. But you cant be gay and still claim to be christian/muslim

      • Bryce
        November 25, 08:40 Reply

        Erm,I hope am not crossing a line trying to correct your impression,but the Bible is not against masturbating neither did it stand directly for it.
        At least,that is my understanding of Leviticus 15:16.That is also the general interpretation of that verse.
        Just my opinion o,please no one should come for my head.New commenter o

        • Max
          November 25, 09:08 Reply

          Do you remember what happened to Onan who spilled his seed?

          • Bryce
            November 25, 09:24 Reply

            I am starting to see why the author of this piece advised us to read in context.
            Onan was supposed to raise children for his late brother via his brother’s widow,so that the name may not be wiped out.
            He decided to enjoy his brother’s wife while not fulfilling the obligation attached to it.That was the wickedness God killed him for,not for masturbating.Gen 38:8-10.
            Are you sure you have actually read the Bible?.Those verses were written in plain,simple language for all to understand.

            • Max
              November 25, 09:35 Reply

              So he was supposed to fuck and impregnate his brother’s wife? And you people still read that book? Still beats me..

              Oh and btw, God said that we should be fruitful and multiply, so sex is supposed to be for procreation and not just sport. So one could also argue that if you’re having sex for another purpose other than that which God has made it for, you’re commiting sin, which is why Onan was punished. Onan didn’t do his job, he spilled his seed instead and if you’re masturbating, you’re not doing Gods given duty which is to multiply and fill the world, so you also deserve to be punished.

              Note: The above argument is based on the information you provided, citing the reason Onan was punished, which also makes it admissible in meting out judgement on those who masturbate because they’re also not doing God’s work.

              So, I don’t give two fucks about what the bible says about most things including sex, marriage etc. They’re all flawed.

              • Bryce
                November 25, 09:56 Reply

                I guess that Hawkings quote applies then.*smiles*
                Do have a nice day.

                • Max
                  November 25, 10:32 Reply

                  For someone who doesn’t want people to come for his head, you seem to stir up trouble

  2. Dick Advocate
    November 25, 06:44 Reply

    Preach Aunty TDC! Take us to church already.. You really did take this Bible-hating bigots to the cleaners.
    I don’t understand Islam and the Quran but that doesn’t mean I’ll go on a rant condemning it and everything it stands for. Humans as a whole should really imbibe the culture of ‘live and let live’.
    The bible is the word of God and when people spew hateful things abt it, it saddens my soul now think abt how the person who created all of us will feel.
    Except of cause you don’t believe in a supreme being then this write up above Wouldn’t touch you in anyway.

    • Masked Man
      November 25, 06:49 Reply

      ‘The bible is the word of god’

      On what basis biko? What’s your proof, your evidence?

      • Chuck
        November 25, 14:48 Reply

        50 points to Masked Man.

    • Max
      November 25, 06:58 Reply

      Mr dick head, ever since you showed up here, you’ve been making quite a show “of” yourself. Give it a rest already.
      The one who created you and put you in one of the most homophobic countries in the world where you’re condemned and cant be yourself and you’ll live and die hiding in the closet, pretending and standing in line, oh and guess what, when he’s tired of dealing with your sorry ass and silly prayers he’ll snuff the life out of you and you’ll go to hell for eternity for being such a dirty little slut. ☺

      You’re welcome to join the #TeamConstantlyFoolish bandwagon .

      • Dick Advocate
        November 25, 07:19 Reply

        Well.. Left to me I think It’s a futile effort arguing with Ignorant-bible-hating-bigots Cum Satanist. I wouldn’t want to get my hands dirty this beautiful morning my good Lord Created for better, saner things.

        • Max
          November 25, 08:05 Reply

          Yes @Satanist. @PP, I’ve told you before, we need to expand our Illuminati ministry. I’m thinking of placing targeted ads all over the web, what do you think? ??

            • Max
              November 25, 08:31 Reply

              *Grabs shield*, that is one efficient angel.

              • Pink Panther
                November 25, 08:34 Reply

                Hahahahahahahahahahahaa!!! Ok, I officially died from this comment.

        • Stranger
          November 25, 17:16 Reply

          LMAO. Satanist long long. You’re cute.

  3. Max
    November 25, 06:52 Reply

    ??????????????????????????????

    You’re so predictable aunty TDC. All this rant just to prove what? You’ve shown once again that you’re exactly what I think you are; shallow, petty, flying on a high donkey, high handed attitude, bully, shady, and delusional.
    Have fun trying to prove the non-homophobic nature of the bible. Come out to your pastor and see what happens, after that, you’re free to try again in convincing us.

    This excuse for an article above is quite intellectually degrading (my IQ just dropped by one or two digits). There’s nothing up there that we didn’t already know, but somehow, your know-it-all attitude wouldn’t let you keep your catty crooked fingers off the damn keyboard.
    You know nothing honey, you don’t. I wonder if you have any living thing as a friend at all, because you’re quite a repulsive human being.

    My recommendation- Take some valium, eat some ice cream and rest your chauvinistic ass.

    • Jon Snow
      November 25, 08:16 Reply

      Hallelujah someborri. This is a day of shades that the lord has made
      I’ll need more tea for this.
      ☕☕☕☕☕

    • Mandy
      November 25, 08:26 Reply

      LOL.
      Max, you do realize a hefty portion of all those insults were directed at you, right? Clearly you two have issues to resolve. Perhaps over tea and a bible conversation? 😀

      • Max
        November 25, 08:32 Reply

        Of course I know why he wrote this. I bet he wakes up in the middle of the night screaming my name.

  4. Absalom
    November 25, 07:34 Reply

    But how do you interpret Bible verses which forbid people to sleep with close relatives as “heterophobic”?

    The same courtesies your Bible extends to darling heterosexuals (seeing as you love them this morning), does it extend them to homosexuals? Did the Bible say, for example: “Oh, you can sleep with a person of the person of the same sex – just not your dad, mum or in-law?”

    Perhaps your quarrel is with the word “manual”? Well, the bible may not be an A-Z instructional text on #HowToAnnihilateHomosexuals but it is a damn good reference book for the homophobe: everything he needs is in there. And you have NOT explained away those verses about stoning homosexuals.

    It’s not by preaching love.

    And it’s not by appealing to hypocrisy either – with reference to coloured fabric etc.

    Give us the real gist: Is the Bible wrong or right about homosexuals?

    How do you prove to someone that you love them when the thing that makes them doubt your love still has that pungent smell? Many abusive men still tell their wives they love them.

    How does your church convince me it loves me when those four pesky verses have not been sawn off?

  5. Mitch
    November 25, 07:40 Reply

    Thank you Tiercel. I’m glad someone here still reasons rationally. 10 homophobic verses don’t make the bible a homophobic manual any more than the gazillions of verses against hetero sex outside of marriage making it a heterophobic manual. Receive sense Kdians!

    • Max
      November 25, 08:11 Reply

      But we can’t get married according to the bible, can we?? At least it gave the heteros a choice, marry and then fuck your brains out. But for the homos, no no no, they should be put to death.

      • #Chestnut
        November 25, 09:20 Reply

        Max, quick question: is is that u don’t believe God exists, or u just don’t agree with the way humans(Christians) practise christianity? I want to get a better understanding of ur POV.

        • Max
          November 25, 09:26 Reply

          ???? #LongSpoonWeilder.. For a second there, I was tempted to answer your question, but on a second thought, l think I’m going to leave you to Wonder.

          • Mandy
            November 25, 11:33 Reply

            Chestnut’s question is legitimate though. I’m not sure I get fully where you stand, Max. Anti-Christ or just anti-the people who work in the Lord’ vineyard?

          • #Chestnut
            November 25, 12:03 Reply

            Hian! I asked an innocent,honest question (for my peace of mind),and I’m still being accused of wielding long spoons *sigh* I can’t catch a break.

            • Chuck
              November 25, 14:57 Reply

              Chestnut, I’d say Christianity is just another strain of religion, influenced by the economic/social/political factors of its place of origin. I don’t see how it is more legitimate than Zoroastrianism, Judaism, or theAncient Egyptian/ Canaanite religions it borrowed from.

  6. Chizzie
    November 25, 07:43 Reply

    Its funny how you are referring to scripture, quoting Bible verse after Bible verse, basically preaching at us and still being insulting, judgmental and condescending in the process, perfectly embodying the average Nigerian christian that I so despise and would rather burn in hell than become.

    Using phrases like “Noisemakers… Fools”, only just showcases your level of maturity. I won’t say I am disappointed but I am shocked as this is such a low, especially coming from someone considerably older.
    You should be able to pass your point across articulately without sounding so sentimental and childish. Wisdom is clearly not a factor of age, thanks for proving that.

    All you succeeded in this post is giving ppl a greater reason to disregard Christianity, while portraying how intensely immature you are

    Give yourself a round of applause

  7. posh6666
    November 25, 08:13 Reply

    Honestly i can relate to this a little bit because at a point in time i became really nonchalant with my prayers and worshiping God as with alot of gays even on this blog,since the holy books condemn my lifestyle and i know i didnt choose to be this way,i knew i loved men as early as probably 6-7yrs.But overtime i have learnt to be gentle on myself and just try my best to worship God everyday and plead for forgiveness and hope to die when am at my most righteous moment,i learnt to stop trying to figure it all out,the holy books really make it so difficult tho and i know alot of people that committed suicide just got tired of it all and decided to end it.Hope this makes any sense.

    • Max
      November 25, 08:34 Reply

      No it doesn’t make any sense, it just proved that Chizzy was right about you.

    • Stranger
      November 25, 17:25 Reply

      Which one is this Holy book you’ve been writing upandan? Aren’t you a muslim? Can’t you just write Quran?

  8. bruno
    November 25, 08:25 Reply

    so this big all-important exposé is somehow supposed to convince us that the bible is not homophobic by showing us exactly how it is? did you even go to school?

    “The Bible: A Homophobic Manual?” lmao! i’ve never seen a more pretentious title for what is essentially barely coherent drivel, poorly thought out arguments and a side of mudslinging.

    it’s only apt that this sad excuse of a post is concluded with a quote by one of the most famous atheists alive. at this point, the joke writes itself.

    leaving writing to those with the actual ability and stick to bickering in the comments instead. it suits you better.

  9. ikhines
    November 25, 08:29 Reply

    Jippy jippy jappa jappa! Not one sense made! This guy needs to tone down his itk attitude tho’. He’s actually a shallow person

  10. Mandy
    November 25, 08:33 Reply

    The people who are saying that this piece doesn’t make any sense are clearly letting their resentment of the writer cloud their judgment. At least one sense is made from this piece: the bible as a manual of Christianity is about love. Simple. Love. The Christianity that Jesus brought to mankind is about love. Over the years, men have simply distorted it (using the bible as a weapon) into different aspects of ugliness, armed with verses from the bible to suit every ugly purpose of theirs.
    Was TDC condescending in this piece? Yes. Clearly he intended to rile as well as educate, something that is not surprising if you know him well from his comments.
    but it doesn’t detract from the truth in his piece. The bible is only as good (or as bad) as the person wielding it.

    • Peak
      November 25, 13:27 Reply

      Only comment that makes sense so far.
      Still reading though.

    • Chuck
      November 25, 15:02 Reply

      The claim that men have “distorted” the Bible implies that there is a “correct” interpretation. What is the evidence that there is a “true” interpretation? Jesus/God the Father/The Holy Ghost did not leave a “How To Read The Bible”, and they don’t have an email for questions.

  11. Sinnex
    November 25, 08:53 Reply

    For a moment there, I thought Today was Sunday.

    I don’t need anyone to validate my religion. If I go to hell because of my sexuality, so be it. At least the same Bible says all liars will go to hell. My sexuality won’t stop me from serving God, going to church, reading my bible daily and getting married. My sexuality won’t make me curse God or disrepute his existence. Whether we like it or not, God remains God. Your opinion doesn’t really matter. In fact, what I would never do it to explain away my sexuality. The truth is that nobody is perfect, over 70 percent of the people in this world would end up in hell, even your pastor. If at the end of it all, the Scientists were right, that would be wonderful. Till then, I will keep on praising my God and living my life.

  12. Tiercel de Claron
    November 25, 09:00 Reply

    Kinda disappointing.
    This was meant to rile,then in disputing we learn together,but bar the usual noisemakers and expected namecallling,I’m yet to see a counter.

    What makes the Bible homophobic?.
    Absalom,anyone?

      • Max
        November 25, 09:12 Reply

        Gad
        king
        Moses
        Nebuchadnezzar, anyone??

    • Chizzie
      November 25, 09:19 Reply

      The thing is TDC, from all indications you aren’t worth having an intelligent conversation with. You use terms like “noisemakers “, in your own dictionary referring to someone as” indigo” means they are intelligent and “downy”. I mean who are we kidding here.

      It’s awon Posh ati Sinnex that can comfortably stoop to your level and engage u in a conversation

      • Chuck
        November 25, 15:06 Reply

        Co – sign, Chizzie. Seconded.

        This whole thing relies on the legitimacy of the Bible in the first place. The book is no more than a collection of Jewish oral traditions, and the writings of the associates of a man called Jesus who lived during the reigns of Augustus and Tiberius.

    • Absalom
      November 25, 09:22 Reply

      I have a question of my own: What makes the Bible pro-LGBT?

      • Tiercel de Claron
        November 25, 09:32 Reply

        Pro-LGBT?.It is not.
        Nor must it be to be relevant or valid.
        Neither is it anti-LGBT in the main.
        It just is.

        • Absalom
          November 25, 09:42 Reply

          Okay. I just wanted to be sure you’re not implying the Bible is pro-LGBT.

          And no, I didn’t say the Bible HAS to be pro-LGBT. No one book in the world can be everything – there’s only so many pages. The Bible is who she is and I am who I am; somehow we don’t quite agree on some of the stuff and that’s OK.

          So…carry on. 🙂

    • Absalom
      November 25, 09:23 Reply

      Tiercel, my question downstairs is for you. Not sure why it dropped itself there.

    • Terra
      November 25, 16:32 Reply

      You really thought from the dispute, we’d learn together? Seriously? This bunch? ????

  13. Duke
    November 25, 09:24 Reply

    This piece had some truths but that attempt at trying to call out a group you considered ” noisemakers” then go around to talk about love and how everybody has an opinion and how you don’t really care about other people’s opinion (at this point, I felt you just wrote this article as an opportunity to get back at some people).

    The Bible amazes me sometimes because I keep discovering something new and noteworthy in it. It has truths, words of wisdom and awesome stories. It condemns many things and shows our flaws as humans but people simply chose parts that make them feel better about themselves. My conclusion? Do you boo boo.

    • Peak
      November 25, 13:33 Reply

      I couldn’t agree more.

  14. ambivalentone
    November 25, 09:28 Reply

    Perhaps if we had had less letters from Paul (who I strongly believe is a push over from the whole Jewish customs of homophobia, women subservience and some pastor-worship) and more gospels, our lives would be soooo much easier. As it stands, as Mandy stated, the word of God is a sword in the hand of the wielder. And wield he did. Btwn Moses (the law giver) and Paul (the lawyer), the two condensed ordinances of Jesus have been buried deep (we know its there), its hard to find that much needed love, equality and humility Jesus preached.

    • Tiercel de Claron
      November 25, 09:50 Reply

      Paul’s upbringing,training and membership of the Pharisee Council before conversion,did colour some of his writings.
      Placed beside Peter’s,John’s or James’ letters,people who actually walked with Jesus,they come out as more liberal-minded than Paul.
      Thing is,he wrote more.

  15. keredim
    November 25, 09:34 Reply

    The thing is, most of the bible especially the old testament where this offensive Leviticus 18:22 features, was written for the Children of Israel.

    The first gay wedding I attending was held in Tel Aviv and it was a mass gay wedding. If the people Leviticus 18:22 was aimed at can move on and focus on the other parts of the bible that express love (and mind you Jews do not refer to the New Testament as its all about Christ), why can’t we as gay Nigerians move on??

    Why do we still keep holding on to that verse and the few others mentioned as the reason the Bible (and Christianity) is homophobic?

    The same way the homophobes use those verses to deride homosexuality is the same way we can use the other love parts of the bible to fight them.

    If the teachings of the bible is not for you, move on to something or nothing else, but don’t sit down and spew hate on people who believe in it and go about their business.

    I am sure whatever else you choose to believe in or not believe in, doesn’t prescribe hate.

    Its all about love. Try it sometime.

    Nice one TdC. I trust you can weather the storm

    • Peak
      November 25, 13:37 Reply

      I was looking out for your take on the matter, and you didn’t disappoint. Well said.

    • keredim
      November 25, 13:48 Reply

      * opps meant to say “…first gay wedding I attended……

      Had to make that correction before bad grammar was added to my list of transgression for existing

    • Chuck
      November 25, 15:07 Reply

      How many Christians believe that homosexuality is legitimate? Why not start there?

  16. Chizzie
    November 25, 10:08 Reply

    The fraternity of Old Gay Daddies for Jesus. Comprising of TDC and Keredim. One a pseudo-wise crone, the other an international harlot. Keep giving the devil a good laugh at Jesus’ expense

    • Dick Advocate
      November 25, 10:34 Reply

      Give it a rest Chizzie, you’ve been commenting and commenting but no one seems to respond to you or ‘it’ I know it hurts but not everytime you can take center stage. Take a back seat on this one.
      You prolly lack some happiness in your life.. I’ll recommend a good dick.

      • Chizzie
        November 25, 11:04 Reply

        But you just responded so I guess it worked? ?

  17. Khaleesi
    November 25, 10:21 Reply

    @TDC, stand up and give yourself a resounding ovation!! you actually memorised the important sections of an old manual of hate!! Bravo!!! **Yawns and rolls eyes***
    Whether or not the hate-filled clobber verses make up 0.001% of the bible, the fact remains that 99.999% of the homophobic hate amongst Christians is directly and inextricably linked to that 0.0001% – the same analogy is applicable to the Muslim book!
    On a brighter note, you have reinforced my opinion that the bible is a 4000 or 5000year old book written largely by a desert dwelling tribe with severely limited insight into the world and according to their customs and traditions as was obtainable at that point in time – it beats my imagination why any sane person would seek to order his life according to such outdated and outmoded dictates!! its like attempting to live strictly as our ancestors did a few thousand years ago – it just wont/cant work!! Also bear in mind that Israel where most of the Holy Bible is set is one of the most gay friendly spots in the world (ask google and others).
    Finally, if you read the entire bible and observe Christianity with an open and unbiased mind and you remain a truly committed Christian, then you’re either enormously ignorant or (am sorry) a big fool … (pick one) …
    Nice piece nevertheless …

    • Tiercel de Claron
      November 25, 11:06 Reply

      Well,you surprise me I must say.
      I was expecting something of the sort of Maxian foaming at the mouth from you,I did take some potshot at you in the piece,to elicit some response,but this…this is reasoned even though we don’t agree on some points.
      For the barb I threw at you,a heartfelt apology.

      Jesus came that we may no longer order our lives “according to such outdated and outmoded dictates”,but by a set of universal and timeless principles.I’m sure the compilers of the Bible at Hippo included the books of the OT,not so we may live by their dictactes,but to show what was and distinguish them from what now is.

      Finally,I’ve read all of the Bible and I find it leaves one with better options than being either of the “enormously ignorant” nor the “big fool”.
      Peace be with you.

  18. Dick Advocate
    November 25, 10:49 Reply

    Like I said earlier, it’s a futile effort engaging with this hate-filled Bigots. TDC you will do well for yourself to let this slide. It’s like trying to convince satan to apologize to God. It’s too late for that don’t you think.
    As a Bisexual guy, I tend to identify more with straight people than with gay people and the reasons why cannot be far fetched than what is unveiling itself on this post today. Just imagine a group of straight people stumbling upon this blog in a bid to try to understand Gays. “let’s know more about this colorful, kind-hearted Gay people” “let us educate ourselves about them” “They are such nice, understanding never judgement sets of people because of the prejudice they go through themselves” they say to themselves, then pick articles up and read up all the above comments. Smh i wouldnt blame them thinking gay people are a group of ‘psychotic, hate-filled occultic members’

    For that straight man out there who would read this piece and the comments, I just want to assure you that we all don’t reason like majority of those group of gay men that commented today.

    • Max
      November 25, 11:05 Reply

      Internalized homophobia is a mental illness. Get help!! before its too late..
      “You identify with straight people more than gay people” ???try telling them that you like dicks or men’s ass and see how they’ll throw you under the bus faster than you can say “straight”.
      ” Hateful bigotic occultists” ?? I’m glad you’re finally getting the memo, this blog isn’t for everyone. Anyone who reads it(gay or straight) is welcome to think whatever the hell they want about it, maybe you didn’t read the Motto above-“We’re here, we’re queer and we’re Fab”. The best part of accepting yourself if that you no longer have to be apologetic about your existence, not to family, not to anyone and certainly not to straight people. They’re welcome to think whatever they like.
      And when you’re done criticizing gay people, you can let your self -loathing self out of this website( I’m sure you know how you got here). Save your data bundle for straight websites.

      • Mandy
        November 25, 11:31 Reply

        Hahahahahahahaa! Max!!! Jeez! Where are your happy pills? You’re in your element today.

      • Jide
        November 25, 17:52 Reply

        For someone so good-looking, you’re unreasonably acerbic . My admiration of you is falling, Max.

  19. JustJames
    November 25, 12:14 Reply

    Lol.. You guys are fucking hilarious.

    The bible is a book.. Whatever you decide to make it make you feel is entirely up to you.

    If you want to be flooded with love you will be.

    If you want to let the sound of the hate filled world drown out the sound of God shouting I still love you no matter what please knock yourself out.

    I kind of feel people who are so vehemently against the bible still have issues with themselves.. I don’t think you can believe a God made out of love exists and still see yourself as wrong in his eyes.. Cause basically you still think you’re wrong.

    If you want to see a big bossy God holding a cane for everytime you do wrong waiting to whip you that’s all you’ll see..

    But I firmly believe God doesn’t hate gay people. He might be against the sex just like he is against lying, jealousy, covetousness, stealing etc but he doesn’t hate us.

    Chill.. Can’t y’all even see.. It’s impossible to please God by our own actions… We are guilty of so many things. Even thinking of doing something is a sin.. I just wish people could see what I see..

    Let me recede back into my La-La-land.

    • Max
      November 25, 13:00 Reply

      Seriously James, he’s against gay sex but not gay people? I expected more from you, really. Seeing you’re one of the youngest here and often display a high level of knowledge and intellect as opposed to some old bozos around here. But this comment of yours sounds lame and its patronizing at best. It sounds like something Tefmushin would write.. People often say that the bible is the word of God or at least inspired by God(which I think is a load of crap btw) and yet the same people talk about God’s love and somehow forgetting to fault the people who wrote the bible in the first place. Please resolve the conflict inside you, you can’t say it’s God’s word and still say God loves gay people. You have to admit the fact that the bible isn’t infallible like the religitards would let you believe, Thats the only way your stance about God’s love for gay people would be valid.

      “I still love you no matter what” << That right there sounds like sounds like- you're a damaged mess because of your sexuality, but I'm willing to overlook it.
      Can you walk into any church around you today and marry a dude? Can you marry formally and have a #religiousGaySex? Those are the options handed down to straight people on a golden platter (marry and have all the sex you want and live happily) while the gay person should be put to death.

      Sorry James, I don't give a shit about what the bible or any other book think about my sexuality. I don't pay a weekly homage to churches anymore for the same reason I don't watch Nigerian movies(they're highly irrelevant) and one can live their life without believing in deviously crafed nonsensical stuff written in the so called holy books.

      Dear James, I'm one of those people who don't care about the bible and its texts anymore and I don't have issues with myself. You seem to be the one with the issues as you've(and some other people around here) have managed to delude yourselves into thinking you're somehow doing something that matters, or that somehow you can be slaying D on Saturday night and weilding a bible on Sunday, or that you can somehow justify "hush marriage" which is championed by the most pious people around here. Stop deceiving yourselves, you cannot wed another man in the church, your so called love isn't valid in the eyes of your beloved pastors and your family will shock you into understanding the real meaning of their #UnconditionalLove if you ever try to come out to them.

      The bible is AGAINST gay people, get over it and stop making excuses for people and the bible itself.

      • Pink Panther
        November 25, 13:08 Reply

        I have to reiterate Chestnut’s question. I’m sorry, Max, but (and you know I don’t give two fucks about religion), but honestly, are you both against God and Christians? Because I’m not sure I understand what you’re hacking at.
        Kindly clarify that for me.
        Because if I were a Bible-thumping gay Christian, I’d have a had time believing that God made me this way only to turn around and hate me. It’s all shades of contradiction, for you to be self accepting that you were born as you are and then believe yourself hated by the God who created you.
        I mean…I can’t…i just can’t.

        Seriously though, Max, what camp exactly are you in?

        • Max
          November 25, 14:07 Reply

          Lmfao @PP ???.. You really want me to tell you?

          • Pink Panther
            November 25, 14:33 Reply

            😀
            Yes please.
            Yes, yes, yes!
            And don’t you dare get dodgy with your answer.

            • Chuck
              November 25, 15:11 Reply

              Via Occam’s Razor, isn’t God a creation of human society to explain away what they could not understand in nature. The same way Africans worshipped thunder and streams is the way the Jews made up Yahweh.

              • Pink Panther
                November 25, 18:09 Reply

                I wasn’t looking for an atheist enlightenment, Chuck.

      • JustJames
        November 25, 22:11 Reply

        For someone who doesn’t give a rat’s ass what the bible says or whatever you sure spend a lot of energy arguing about it.

    • #Chestnut
      November 25, 13:13 Reply

      James, I actually got misty-eyed on reading ur comment #TearsOfJoyAndPrideAndGratitude…thank you…thank you.

    • Mandy
      November 25, 13:22 Reply

      How is it that more people are not going by this James’ outlook on the bible and on God, hmm? It involves so much less energy and isn’t even emotionally tasking to simply believe in the good and not the bad.

  20. Mavourneen
    November 25, 12:41 Reply

    This is one of the best posts I’ve seen so far on KD. But to think of the reason why some of the so called “noisemakers” are taking it so personal is the question here. You are afraid of the truth being told to your face. SMH…. I’m really ashamed. that’s why majority of you end up in one trouble or the other.

  21. Kenny
    November 25, 13:13 Reply

    James!!!! Marry me please

  22. sensei
    November 25, 14:35 Reply

    Thank you, TDC for the article, even though I may not entirely agree with your approach (i.e. Rile em up and make them talk. Lol!). But different strokes for different folks. I wanna make a few points:
    1. Religion is man’s search for purpose and meaning. It is a phenomenon that appears as a consequence of man’s reaching, mostly blindly groping I think, for something higher than he is. 
    2. There are many religions in the world. All of these represent man’s attempt to REACH. Being an attempt by imperfect man, I don’t think any religion is flawless.
    3. The question concerning the value or otherwise of any religion is one that each person must answer for himself or herself…as it should be. For the religious experience should be something very personal, since the heart is compass for navigating the spiritual terrain. 
    4. Swallowing any ideology that is handed to you, hook, line and sinker is dangerous (look at ISIS and BH and you get what I mean). There is therefore a need to critically weigh before you swallow (okay that last bit didn’t come out right. Lol!)
    I don’t think accepting everything any religion teaches as absolute truth is okay. If all that can be known is already revealed in any one book (wch is not the case), then your internal spiritual  compass becomes useless and vestigial. That is how the dogma of religion has hindered the spiritual expansion of mankind. Jesus was killed because he taught new truth that he did not read from any scripture. How sad that history keeps repeating itself! We forget that all scripture was once upon a time just a truth is someone’s heart. There is no truer scripture than a right heart. ‎
    5. The bible is too many things to so many people. I would have to conclude that what each person makes of it is more a reflection of his or her personal experience and internal musing than anything else. A person can be homophobic because of the bible and a person can be tolerant of homosexuality because of the bible (yes, those exist too). The bible says, “kill the gays!”. But it also says, “love your enemies, always forgive, love unconditionally”. How each person resolves the riddle in this apparent contradiction not just reflects who they are and their understanding of the bible, it also will determine whether they toss religion or evolve a personal version for themselves. No matter the outcome, I think it’s acceptable. Unless the person involved thinks it’s not of course. ‎

    • Pink Panther
      November 25, 14:39 Reply

      ‘The bible says, “kill the gays!”. But it also says, “love your enemies, always forgive, love unconditionally”. How each person resolves the riddle in this apparent contradiction not just reflects who they are and their understanding of the bible, it also will determine whether they toss religion or evolve a personal version for themselves.’

      THIS!
      I am so in love with sensei right now.

      • Chuck
        November 25, 15:12 Reply

        here’s a way to resolve the riddle: all the religions are made up.

  23. Peak
    November 25, 15:11 Reply

    TDC let me start by saying that I am not a fan of the tone of this article, brilliant work nonetheless.

    For those of us who have conducted emperical studies, inferences are usually drawn based on variable that are significant in proportion. If the condemnation of homosexuality is estimated at 0.0001%(going by this article) then its safe to safe that the book is not a homophobic manual. Unfortunately the homophobes don’t care. They would find and latch on anything to discredit our existence and beliefs. And going by some of the comments here, we are no better than they are.
    The bible is basically hinged on 2 significant figure (God & Jesus. I’d like to add the holy spirit, but he acted like a 3rd party mostly)
    God is the supreme and ultimate feature in the book. And this supreme being, according to several accounts, gave some sets of commandments (constitution) which served as the MAJOR guide at the time. These set of rules (the 10 commandment) was still in operation by and during the ministration of Jesus. Due to the humans talent for misconstruing God’s word, making rules and judging on his behalf, Jesus shrunk and simplified constitution to just ” Love God and Love thy Neighbour” for a better understanding. A close look at the 10 commandment would show you, that the above phrase pretty much covers the 10 commandment.

    Does the bible have some inconsistencies that I am having a hard time over looking? Yes.
    Does the Bible contain a lot of indissmisable rule and principles that would make me a better person? Yes. So why not focus on the glaring good it projects rather than going on treasure hunt just to understand it syllable by syllable. Like Gad once said, it is a book of Mysteries.

    At the end of the day, its you and ur God! They tell you salvation/Christianity is a personal race. Indulge for a moment while I borrow from some of Max’s analogy when it comes to being gay and acceptance. “You dont owe anybody an explanation on how to live ur life”. Add that with what the bible has to say about salvation, and you realise that you don’t owe anybody an explanation. Not ur pastor, or ur parents on how ur sexuality aligns with the will of God, bcos at the end of the day, IT BETWEEN YOU AND YOUR GOD!

    I stopped being a fan of religion a long time ago. Why? Because it is the perfect weapon for HATE! Christians seeing Muslims as infidels, Muslims seeing christians as scum. And both channeling hate to everything that is not in alignment with the main teachings of both holy books which is LOVE. that is the main message of the books! Love me regardless of where I am from, love me regardless of who I am sexually attracted to, love me regardless of the colour of my skin or the texture of my hair. Love me regatdless of my believes and leave whatever misgivings to me and MY God! Because it is a private and personal matter between him and I. I can’t come out to my pastor cos he interprets based on his understanding. Same as my parents and the society at large so let it be between me and my Maker.

    But humans just have a hard time staying in their lane or minding their business. Homophobes feast on Leviticus. How about we talk about the countless sins in the bible? Is fornication and adultery not punishable by stoning to death? Worshipping of false gods nko? But like the homophobes, we choose to nitpick around the bible.

    I have spent years questioning my existence and my relationship with God. Stayed away from church for over a decade, experimented with another religion. One thing was clear during and after that time, mankind and its religions keeps making one vital mistake, neglecting the CORE message for insignificant ones. Thats what homophobes do, thats what religious bigots do. That what “we” are doing now.

    They say God doesn’t make mistakes. We aren’t all clones who are expected to look and act alike. I was no mistake. They say before i was born, he knew me in the womb. He knew what my life would look like, be like, so why let being gay happen? They equally say God will never give you what you cant handle (cliche) so here we are.we need to spend more energy respecting our differences and diversity as humans. And maybe, just maybe, we might start getting the true message enshrine in the books.

    Awesome job TDC. Keep it coming. U reminded me of Gad today. I miss the annoying and condescending evil fox.

    • Keredim
      November 25, 15:44 Reply

      ??????????????
      Well said…..
      So Peaksy wicksy about that my marriage proposal….☺️☺️

      • Max
        November 25, 15:49 Reply

        Ummm, Kerewa, Peak likes younger dudes.

        • Keredim
          November 25, 16:00 Reply

          … That wasn’t WHAT he said last night?

          • Max
            November 25, 16:03 Reply

            *??? who would’ve thunk it? That Peak likes to be tossed around like Cinderella on bed by a big daddy

    • Max
      November 25, 15:47 Reply

      But you and TDC arent saying the same thing Na. What you wrote is so much better and more comprehensible.

      • Keredim
        November 25, 15:59 Reply

        Come on MAX, be REASONable.?Some of us have said the same thing one way or another, but you just weren’t having any of it.

        Maybe you have a soft spot for Peak. Maybe he takes you back to your “better place”??

    • Pink Panther
      November 25, 18:05 Reply

      ‘We need to spend more energy respecting our differences and diversity as humans.’

      This! This right here! Well done, Peak.

  24. tarter
    November 25, 16:40 Reply

    ok,so much venom here,y’all need 50 bags of dangote sugar to calm your titties and add sweetness in your lives.. ahn ahn..nawao..so,what do u say about Corinthians 6-9 where the bible boldly said even effeminate guys won’t make heaven? even if they aren’t gay oo..oya,I’m waiting

    • Max
      November 25, 17:08 Reply

      1 Corinthians 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

      6:13 Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.

      6:18 Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.

      • Pink Panther
        November 25, 18:13 Reply

        And it becomes clearer and clearer that nobody will make this heaven. Oh chim.

        • façade
          November 25, 18:58 Reply

          Lol. Even if I end up going to hell, at least I know I won’t be alone

        • Tiercel de Claron
          November 25, 19:28 Reply

          And he conveniently leaves out 6:10-11,to wit,

          10 Nor thieves,nor covetous,nor drunkards,nor revilers,nor extortioners,shall inherit the kingdom of God.
          11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed,but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus,and by the Spirit of our God.

          Cherrypicking,thou art a KDian

      • Dick Advocate
        November 25, 19:21 Reply

        “Foolishness is bound up in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him.” Proverbs 22:15

        Max like I have said before and will always say, like a child that you are, you need a good Rod-like Dick to set you on a right, reasonable thinking path.

        • Max
          November 25, 21:51 Reply

          Lol, you’re so easy??

    • tarter
      November 25, 22:41 Reply

      tiercel yea,i cherry picked, but u still didn’t answer my question, waiting for answers

  25. Jamie
    November 25, 19:23 Reply

    I missed the best controversial post of my stay on KD!!
    I was once a ”born-christian”, and now I say christianity, like all religions are shit!! You know why?
    1. Cos gods never come down to complain or explain ambigous verses!!
    2. Cos my conscience is enough to make me the best me!!
    3. Cos it is pathetically homophobic. And if humans toyed with it, the word of that god, and he doesn’t come down to say anything, he is stupid, a noise maker and a cheat!! I need no validation from it, just like I don’t from Islam, Buddhism…etc. I’m only being sincere…

Leave a Reply